Peruvian Ayahuasca Shaman Don Gino Shares Ancient Tribal Knowledge and Wisdom

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Maestro Gino comes from Puno, the highlands of Peru and has extensive experience in working with Master Plants from the Peruvian Amazon. From the lineage of the Incas and with a grandfather who was Curandero (Yatiri or healer), Don Gino got his initiation into the knowledge of the Master Plants during his youth. His grandfather, who solely spoke Quechua and died at the age of 100, led Gino to the ancient and unique knowledge of the Andean cosmology of the three worlds: the Hanan Pacha (Higher World ruled by Kuntur), the Kay Pacha (this world ruled by Puma) and Utku Pacha (underworld ruled by the Snake).

The Maestro Don Gino Chaka Runa strongly felt the call of the Amazon and started doing dietas with Master Plant Ayahuasca. This was at the Munay Retreat Pucalpa, headed by Don Jose Campos, by whom he was further trained. By now over sixty years, Don Gino belongs among the Mestizo line Meastros.
At the beginning of this line was Don Solon Tello (Maestro from Iquitos Peru), Don Wilfredo Hojanama and Don Jose Campos (the first two already passed away).

At present, the Maestro Don Gino works in several places, including Pucalpa in the peruvian Amazon, Lima, Cusco and the Sacred Valley of the Incas in Peru.
He travels the world, for the third year now in Europe, to accompany many people in their process of transformation and healing. His honest, conscious work is performed with love, light and passion and is based on the Shipibo rituals for healing which also use the tobacco Master Plant Mapacho and the Chakapa leaves. The Mapacho plant brings male energy while the ancient healing Chakapa leaves help to cleanse the body, the aura, the etheric body, the crown and . Maestro Don Gino work from the heart to bring light and healing to the people he works with to let them live to their full potential.

 

Transciption of Video:-

 

Don Gino: Peruvian Ayahuasca Shaman of the Mestizo tradition

 

DG

My name is Gino ……. I come from Peru, from the natives of the Andes, the Incas, my grandfather was an Inca. He passed at 100 years old he was a Curandero , a healer, very powerful. So he introduced me at a young age to work with plants the Pachamama The Apus, nature, the wind, water, fire and the dirt. And then later I embrace the wisdom of the Amazonian, I was called the Chakaruna. Chaka is the bridge, Runa is the spirit, the human bridge, which bridge the up and down, the north and south, human with nature. that is the work of the Chakaruna. And the shaman who works with both knowledges, the Andean and the Amazonian which go pretty much together and the way to do this work is mainly through the right attitude, with an open heart transferring crystal clear honest, respectful and especially humble.

JB

Thank you Don Gino.
We’re here in Codogno, Italy and we’ve just finished a 3 day ayahuasca retreat, don Gino you grew up in Peru and you have a lot of knowledge on many of the tribal traditions, I have very limited knowledge  but from what I’ve heard about the Shipibo traditions, it is very difficult to integrate it into modern lifestyles in the west in particular for example I heard that the warriors, when they drink ayahuasca, they stand and they hold a spear and that if it gets really really overwhelmingly powerful they can only go down to one knee but nothing more they cant lay down or sit so they stand for most of the ceremony.
DG
Well that is a very special ayahuasca vine that really gets you stiff you can not even move the muscles, that is very rare. Most of the tribes, Shipibo, Machiguenga, Okama, and Inca Cero – many others use the plant as medicine because in the tribes there was not hospitals, no doctors so they had to use whatever was in reach. If a kid was bitten by a spider they would bring him to the shaman and the shaman would know what plant to put as a plaster or what to drink or if a little kid has a parasite they would drink another plant – maybe Howe Something like that to kill the parasites inside. it is very powerful but risky. Every plant has a balance. You overdo and instead of healing you, you will get worse. In the olden days these plants were used like that but were also used to to see beyond, for instance if a native had a cow stolen he would go to the shaman. The shaman would drink ayahuasca which is a master plant and in his visions he could see who stole the cow and where it is and when he comes back he would tell he person – “you see that mountain over there, that little house, go there, your cow is there” and the person would go and the cow was there. So a shaman which is a word we don’t use in the amazon, in the Andes it is called Yatiri In the highlands, a very strong healer –  Kecho, also the Taita which is the elder with certain knowledge of how to prepare a gazpacho or paying back to Pachamama. Next level is the pampa Misauchi who is even higher than the Taita, more power doing the gazpacho or communicating with nature with the apus. The apus are the mountains. Every mountain has a deity inside, it’s called an apu. Very strong. The mountains and the apus are the higher expression of the earth going to heaven. The alto misaiuc which is the highest is the one that really is a strong shaman who can do the same as the others but can also have power over nature, over the rain, over the clouds, over the wind, over the darkness sides. The supai, the supai chakra is always playing games, the darkness in the mountains, so these people are chosen. A pomysaiuc has a very special conditions because in the end for instance there are a lot of kids that go to pasture the cows and they go barefoot and there are a lot of storms, a lot of very strong storms with thunder and lightning ray. Probably in a year one or two kids die struck by thunder or ray (lightning).  but one kid, even if struck by a ray, doesn’t die, and its even said that they are struck 3 times. The first ray breaks him down, kills him, the second gives him life and the third the pieces together. And that kid is open in his pineal gland and that kid was chosen by pachamama because he didn’t die, even through a ray and he becomes an Altomisayoq. This kid is put under the wing of an elder Altomisayoq during  his whole life to learn all the wisdom. In the amazon, on the other side there is taita also the onnaia(?) who is shaman Curandero with certain powers, and then the myraia who is even bigger, has other powers – plants, animals –and then the Sumiruna who is like the Altomisayoq in the andes. It is said that these guys could go in the river and without coming out of the river they could go to another town underwater, in some myths. Of course every myth has a certain reality. So the shaman or Curandero – in the amazon they call it Curandero or pallero(?) or veyetallista(?). Pallero  – pallo is stick or a tree and since they heal with the skin of the tree, the many trees they know, they are called palleros. Veyetallista means vegetalist so they know more about the plants all kind of plants and leaves, how to cook how to grow for cetain diseases. And the ayahuascero, the ayahuascero, can be ayahuascero and veyetallista, can be ayahuascero, veyetallista and pallero. Which is a very strong one. The shaman word comes from Siberia, the tingus(?) tribe many many years ago. And it meant sha-man the one who knows, the one who knows what? There was a tribal mode. Mostly in each tribe was an elder. The elder was the one who knows because he has a lot of experience, but knows what in those times? Where was going to be be a good raining season, when there would be a good hunting season, how to heal a little boy, when they would be attacked by the enemy tribe, how to go into the other realm to connect with the spirits and bring information. So at the end my belief is that a real shaman has 4 legs like a table: the seer, the one that sees beyond – “I feel that we are going to be attacked by another tribe in a couple weeks” –that is a seer, the healer who heals the tribes in many ways – spiritually, physically, emotionally; the warrior, in ceremony and out ceremony, very strong especially in ceremony. And the maestro because he is the elder, he is the one that knows better, he is the one that teaches the tribe on the values and how to behave. This is a good shaman with the four legs, of which there area now very few. And the same I am that – I have some of those legs, maybe the four, I don’t know, I am not the one to say. But this is my understanding.

JB

Could you perhaps explain the calling to become a shaman because iv’e heard through various shamans that I’ve met before – one from mexico who was struck by lightning as a baby and that was a sign in their village that he was a shaman and he got initiated from a very young age.

DG

As I’ve said I think the Pachamama and nature calls you sometimes the tribe or the community sees your power and difference, the river. This is a calling you can feel it from when you are very young. I’ve felt it myself since I was 15 years ago I’m 61 now so it took me 61 years to become a shaman. People ask me how many years have you been a shaman? 61 years – it is a whole life. You start doing certain things, you are a seeker. You ask questions you don’t take everything for granted. Very simple things – questions: Where do I come from? Why am I here? What for? Where am I going?

JB

I believe that transformation is a very important factor when you have a certain experience and you get an extremely valuable lesson, revelation and then you are transformed and the person you were before that is almost like a different person.

DG

You are always the same person. Always. It’s just that those parts that you are already are not ready to come up still. You have to go through a long path. The best shamans are the ones that have gone into their own darkness. Really really dark. The more darkness you go into the light calls you because you are in darkness and when you reach the light you transform but knowing both sides of the coin. You know the darkness, you’ve been there for years and then you decide to go into the light. Only then you can become a good shaman because you know how darkness works. You can spot darkness and darkness can not fool you. Some are tempted by the darkness again to come back with more knowledge and some go. But the good ones stay with the light. They work through the darkness for the light. This is how it works.

JB

 

That really resonates with me because I’ve been to a few ceremonies with other shamans where they just played happy music the whole night and I couldn’t purge. I had to leave and go outside in nature. The last 3 nights it was a mixture of very beautiful happy music then some minor sad bluesy music that really allowed everyone to explore the shadow and accept what they find and be at peace with it.

 

DG

The thing is that as I said in the natives – the Shipibo, the Metzchiengas, Concamas – they have a very fixed tradition – nowadays there is a native shaman, the Mestizo shaman who is in between the new age shaman if you want to call it that – but to me the Mestizo shaman for these days is the one that works better because he comes from the native but he also comes from the other world. So he understands both worlds. The natives in how they deal with the diseases that are brought from Europe or other developed countries such as PTSD disorder, bi-polarity, psychosis, stress, depression, sexual abuse, physical abuse, bad parenthood, bad childhood. Those things don’t exist in the tribe. The Mestizo, probably having travelled abroad many times but also staying in the natives, he can really understand what the developed countries bring because he has been mingled and blended in those cultures, which is my case. Speaks many languages, people can understand and today it is very funny and risky because even in Peru you can find many shamans that are just fake. The fact that you wear a wrap or some feathers doesn’t make you a shaman. Even people who say “my grandfather was a shaman, my father was a shaman, I am a shaman” It is not like that. You can transfer the knowledge and the tools but you can never transfer the power. You either haver the power or you don’t have it. If you don’t have the power you can even go to a ceremony learn some songs play the shaman but there’s no power and the people feel it. When the shaman is powerless and is not a rock then anything can happen in the ceremony – drama, shouting, people going crazy because there is no rock. When there is a rock only the presence, you are the owner of that orchestra and you play with that orchestra, going high, a little low, high again for a lot of people to do the work, low and then you start bringing it back. You see being said about Anahuasca they drink Jurema and mimosa and they say they can stay 6, 8, 10, 12 hours. Of course – everyone goes at their own rhythm. Here you can see that in 4 hours we take everybody in, take everybody up, down, spread the energy, again up, again down and then bring them all back as a unit. This is the ceremony. You are the leader, the guide, the rock, the shaman, the Curandero, the warrior. Now you go to Europe or anywhere in the States or Canada and you pick up a stone and there is a shaman under the stone, everywhere. And this a risk. Going with a shaman is like picking a doctor for a big surgery. When you look for a doctor you really want a doctor who knows. Where are the references? Did he do surgery on you? Yes. How was it? So you have to do your homework otherwise you are putting your life, your spiritual energy, your heart, your mind in the hands of a person that maybe you should not. So before looking at the wrap, the wrap, the feathers or the native looks, try to see who is inside that person. And if you can not ask for references – “how was it for you?” Some people go to a shaman and come back more sick and with some darkness inside of them that they can feel. I have seen that many many times. And because you went to somebody that was not prepared. That’s why I always say the shamans from abroad can be good but you have to learn and even if you learn but don’t have the power it can be risky. Some of course have the power. It is a gift. They go to the amazon they do a dieta 10 days and they feel the call – “Oh I’m the shaman, I’m the shaman now – oh my god” and they go back home and they start doing their own ceremonies with 10 days experience. People can die. I have seen many things. People thrown against the wall, people choking because there is no shaman, there is no rock. When the shaman comes into the room you can feel the presence and the energy. Without it being a big show – humble. But you can feel the presence, very strong, you feel safe, you feel secure, you trust. Then you go. There are two people in the corner watching, they call them guides. They guide what? They guide you to the toilet because that’s all they can do. Because they are just watching you. Nobody creates the vibrations.

JB

Nobody taking the initiative and really….

DG

Not even initiative. All this work is really about vibration, about controlling the energies that are happening, People now say “I’m gonna hold space” what is holding space? You’re gonna hold space? You don’t hold the space, you create the space for things to happen. You create, you clean the space. You make a sacred place and then you do whatever you have to do in a protected space. But theses are words that everybody uses – “I’m gonna hold the space” but to me it’s just words. Create the space for this to happen, it has to be sacred, respect, reverence, real humbleness, honesty, crystal clear working with your heart, with your best vibration. Also we have problems I always say separate anything that you bring outside the door. Come with your best intention. Clean before anybody can do the work, any shaman – shamans can also get dirty – I know many many shamans that have such darkness. Before I come to Europe every week I do my own work, drinking.

JB

Is that alone in silent darkness?

DG

 

I drink with my people with my employment cookers, we drink even before cooking we make a ceremony, sitting in the chair. We’re gonna clean. Clean, clean clean, then we start cooking. You have to be clean to cook the brew with the best intention. Blow to the mother, sing to the mother in each bowl. Ask forgiveness for cutting – and ask permission for using the beautiful medicine to heal and then that medicine is at peace, is at ease. If ayahuasca is not at ease then things happen in the ceremony, many things, it is the spirit. A very old spirit.

JB

I have done Ayahuasca 18 times now, and the first 6-8 times were incredibly healing and then I got to a point where I was purging a lot but there was a last bit that I couldn’t purge and people tried to help but it wasn’t coming out and it happened a few times and I thought the medicine was not working for me anymore. But last night I got an incredible lesson so I had the problem a little bit on the first and second nights so there was still a little bit left that I couldn’t purge and I really put all my effort in and it didn’t quite come. Then last night I didn’t purge at all, and when the sickness came I promised mother ayahuasca that I would stick to what I had promised to do, which is to do good and do specific tasks. And ayahuasca has really helped to give the strength to become a better person.

DG

That is the aim, but be careful that if you commit to the mother a promise you have to deliver it. Otherwise she gives it back, I’m telling you. She sees everything – in the ceremony and outside the ceremony every behaviour.

JB

I have studied science most of my life and it seems like humanity and a lot of scientists are under a delusion that we are the most intelligent animal/creature being on the planet. Yet very simple – what we consider simple – lifeforms like bacteria have evolved to live far far longer and live much more purer yet we still think we are the smartest and surrendering to mother ayahuasca you really feel that you are back in the womb and she really nourishes you again and basically teaches you that there is far more intelligence in plants and nature than humans.

DG

Plants have been here millions of years before us, they have all the knowledge – they have seen how the planet was shaped – everything. And they transfer this information from vine to vine to vine. That’s why sometimes they take you to see the universe. You see how the earth was shaped, you see your past lives it’s a connection with the spirits. She just drops the veils as I explained. I call her the best apocalypsis(?) because  in greek apocalypsis is “dropping the veil”. So she just drops the veil so you can see inside. Everything is already there but you are blind. The matrix keeps you blind you cannot see. You think that because you wake up in the morning and you open your eyes you are awakened. You are even more sleeping when you open your eyes than when you are dreaming because in dreaming you are in an altered state of consciousness. When you open your eyes you come into this theatre of so-called reality, unless you wake up and then you can play the game. Its just a game. You start feeling the vibrations of the persons in their eyes, in their voice, in how they move. You can feel it. That is a good shaman. Shamans are so awakened when you see a shaman you will see that they hardly blink, not on purpose ,they hardly blink, they are always looking at everything.  Once in a while of course to wet the eyes of course but then they are always aware, always alert without blinking. You will notice this, the shaman hardly blinks. Not on purpose, it is just something that happens, it is natural.

JB

Awareness of the presence

DG

Shamans are always present. You can be a good shaman in a ceremony. If the medicine is good, anybody can do the ceremony and it will work, with a lot of risks. The shaman is known outside, in his daily life, in his behaviour, how he treats his people, respect, humbleness, reverence for life. Respecting nature, caring for people, caring for himself, taking care of his loved ones. This is a good shaman.

JB

Could you tell me a bit about what actually goes into the ayahuasca mixture? There are many different recipes.

DG

There are many different recipes of course. I stick to the old one from the Shapivo tribe. Others put tobacco, others put even toye(?) the bird? Flower it is very risky. Or other plants – sometimes I use chagropanga(?) but mainly I just use the kapi(?) in the chacloona(?), this is the old mixture. And I brew it myself, I do not work with anything I have not brewed myself. It takes time it takes effort – 3 weeks – you have to boil and boil for hours and hours. Some people even – because it has become really a business, everyone jumping in because they think there is money or power or ego even sex – and they brew and they take 10 cooks of the same plants because they think they are going to get more. That is very irresponsible. I do two brews and that’s it because the …. gets less and less and less. Other take 3 or 4. My system is 2 brews, that’s it. The first one is very strong and then the second one is still strong and then I cook that and I reduce the medicine and you see the medicine I get, very powerful, thick and the spirit is there at ease in peace, so that is my system. I don’t use any other thing. It’s water, ayahuasca and chacloona.

JB

Could you explain the different vines – there’s a yellow, there’s a red and various other colours, what is the….

DG

There are many many others, but some ayahuascas don’t do anything. There is the yellow ayahuasca, it is good, it is strong. The red ayahuasca – puca(?) ayahuasca, the yellow is the kayo(?) ayahuasca and then the black ayahuasca – yanna(?) ayahuasca, goes very down. I work with the sielo(?), for me after trying all them it is one that works better, sielo ayahuasca which means heaven, heaven ayahuasca. And the difference is –well to recognise the vine when you cut it it is the only one that has the little flower shape in the middle. There are thousands of vines. You can cut them all and they don’t have this flower and also when you chew it it is sour and it makes your lips numb. Sielo ayahuasca has a very red vine in in the middle and it is very very light, dark ayahuasca is very heavy and sielo is called sielo maybe because it is light in the weight. It is a very good one, it takes you to the 3 worlds: the under world, this one and the upper one. Other ayahuasca or anahuasca they take you to bliss, in your heart, the love, there’s no work. First you need to do your work and that is going to the 3 worlds which is linked to the Andean cosmovision which is based on the 3 worlds: the ukupacha(?) as you call it – pachamamma, the underworld where the darkness is and your own shadows and it ruled by the snake. Then you go to the kaipacha(?) which is this plane  – past lives, present, near future, information, insights, after the cleansing. It is ruled by the puma. Then you are taken to the hanakchama(?) or the upper world which is ruled by the condor taking the souls to bliss.In my view the incas, which were all of the natives in the amazon, they designed the cosmovision based on these 3 worlds and the only way to see this is through ayahuasca. So they drank these plants before in san pedro(?), there are temples in the north of peru , there is a huge temple where they found in high relief in san pedro, the image of ayahuasca. Because there was a big connection between the amazon and the andes. You go to the andes where there is no amazon you have many ruins and some ruins you will find, up in high relief, monkeys. There are very big monkeys  in the andes. They  were brought by the amazonians as pets to the incas, also food, parrots guacamayos(?) and feathers, seeds and of course, medicinal plants which only the elite could drink at that time. Nobody else was allowed to, only the elite of the empire. They would go, drink, and go to the other realm, take all this powerful information, come back and apply it and share it with the community and the tribe. Then was like that. Now, probably mother ayahuasca is trying to shape the new elites. What I say is that we have opened the bottle of the genie and the genie is out and nobody can stop the genie. Not inn control. The bad thing is we don’t even know what the 3 witches(?) are. So the genie is just out there and that is why the bad shamans are using it and putting people at risk, none shamans are using it putting people at risk, anahuasca is cooked putting people at risk.

JB

 

A good friend of mine who is Colombian, about 20 years ago he went travelling into the amazon in Colombia and he went missing and no one heard from him for many many months. And his father went to look for him and found him living with the tribe and he was married to the witch doctor’s daughter and they found him running naked and just making animal noises so he took him back to Bogota where he lived – he was a very wealthy lawyer – he took his son to see so many top top doctors and after 2 years they couldn’t help him at all he was still making animal noises and they said he should see an ayahuasca shaman. He did 2 weeks of ayahuasca ceremony and he was fine. Now he is rock climbing all the time.

DG

The Ayahuasca scientist community is very aware of what it is and they have respect. I have a friend in psychiatry from High school who did- I’m not a very particular shaman I grow in the andes also in the city , maybe a woman shaman I don’t know. This is not what I live off this is not my source of income. I studied I do architecture and other things, I do this from the heart I am 61 already, getting a little tired, my body is starting to break down. Probably I will do one more year maybe, but going to your question, this friend of mine who did ayahuasca since university to study from the scientific point of view, he was asked “So do you believe anybody can take ayahuasca?” He said “ No. the heart is at risk, asthma, also you can choke, diabetes” But from my point of view, bipolars, psychotics, schizophrenics, – they cannot take ayahuasca, at least as it is known now. Maybe the future will be microdoses, I think they are working on that. But for now they can not take it because all these diseases that are put on the person is only his ego, it is a house of cards and what the ayahuasca does first is cut the ego and then the house of cards crumbles. And that person can not find himself again , they are lost, so maybe that is what happened to this kid.

JB

They call it the teacher plant but there are various other medicinal plants that are used such as tobacco, which is a different form of tobacco that is used in cigarettes can you explain why tobacco shamans put tobacco as the king of all plants?

DG

It is because it is older, its abuelo(?) tobacco it works in many many ways, cleansing purging, healing , protection. It could be said that it is the older but I think that ayahuasca in my personal view has much more power. For tobacco we have to have a lot of respect and when they work together it is even much better. It was used before in the tribes when they didn’t know ayahuasca. They would chew it, to swallow, or to spit it or to heal a wound or to heal a child with so-called mal de ocho(?) , the suplada(?) And they are still working with that but it is not my expertise. I know a little bit, so I don’t know what I don’t know but ayahuasca is what I do and beyond that I don’t speak more about ayahuasca. My expertise is consciousness, this is what I know about and talk about which ayahuasca brings to you. Ayahuasca there are a lot of books and youtube which you can read. There is a lot of nonsense said in those but some is true. Nobody can tell you what an ayahuasca experience is not even you that you have done. Nobody can understand, you have to go through it yourself.

JB

The people that you learned your tradition from, do they use mushrooms at all?

DG

Very little in the amazon. It is more from the occidental part. Now they are bringing it in because of the fashion. In cusco(?), in the andes, for the foreigners. Not many in the amazon, no.

JB

And for mushrooms, how does the knowledge differ?

DG

Every plant has a different knowledge a different spirit. Ayahuasca has this beautiful divine feminine spirit, san pedro has a male spirit, very strong to connect with pachammam. There is a little infant spirit in the mushrooms, playful. Every plant has it’s risk. Also you can go to darkness. You can go to darkness with san pedro, depends on who is guiding you. That is why I say when people ask you “can I drink ayahuasca by myself?” I say “it is a free world but my answer is no” Because you can have 100 beautiful ceremonies but in the 101th you will go in to doors that you don’t want to open by yourself and then there will be nobody to bring you back and then you will be in trouble.

JB

A valuable lesson. I really felt like in these ceremonies with you, it was a very strong feminine presence with mother ayahuasca and there were a lot of women, I think more women than men in the group and then your masculinity really brought balance and I really felt that the rock that you provided like a pillar of support it was very very good for guidance.

DG

This is what I learned. The shamans were very humble, they don’t move around doing theatre. I’ve seen many ceremonies with people going around , dancing, touching. I’m not criticising – everyone has their own system. My first lesson was – you have to be a rock and the rocks don’t move unless the are needed. So if you are a rock rooted and with presence there is no need to move around. Your presence is over there if you want with the chapaca(?). Sometimes you need to approach to do personal work. Only when you need to otherwise you don’t. This is how I do my work. I’m not comparing, not better or worse its just the different way. The mestizo way. And in my case meztiso because I am half  Italian also from my father. So I have the European blood, plus the inca blood, plus the negro blood and the whole mixture. I have been walking on that path since I was 15. Always. And now, finally, I decided to do this some years ago without leaving behind my other income. I live on my other income, this is something I do only twice a year in Europe. In Peru I go there not so much because I want to rest. That was my commitment to come twice a year to do the work and then go back home to rest with my family.

JB

And a well deserved rest.

DG

Yeah it’s hard. The ceremony is like a circus. There are so many energies, 20 people. The circus meaning the guy who plays with the balls, the juggler. One ball is 20 persons, that is one ball. You want 20 balls. Different problems, different traumas, different gifts, different approach, whatever. The second ball is the ceremony itself, the energy. Sometimes it is too high you have to lower it, sometimes it is really low you have to bring it up. The third ball is all the animals and plants and all masses that you call it in space. 4th ball – my own energy. 5th ball mother ayahuasca’s energy. 6th ball – the darkness playing around. One ball goes down and the circus goes down.

JB

Before starting each ceremony you mentioned to forget everything you have learnt in the past and wipe the slate clean and that really struck home. Very important message there.

DG

The thing is that many people read, watch youtube, get stories from other people, religion…

JB

Science can also be considered a religion..

DG

Science, bringing your mind, your reason. All that is not needed. Not even not needed, it is forbidden because if you go like this then you have so many things in your mind that your mind will not shut up in the 4 hours and the medicine will not get through.

JB

The best way is to leave your logic at the doorstep

DG

There is nothing you need to understand. This one (pointing to temple) wants to understand everything. How is that? Why is this happening?” You don’t need this. You are going to go beyond that in consciousness. Some people even see their bodies and see everything that is happening around. So the less you bring in or the more blank you come. Even the ceremony yesterday – forget it. Or the other shaman ceremonies, good or bad, forget it. youtube – no. Just come blank, surrender. If you have a cup of tea what makes the cup useful is the void. If the cup is not empty there is no use. You have to throw it away first to make it useful again. That is why I say come empty, open and ready to receive the mother. That void is what is useful. If you have this (head) totally full nothing will get through it will just create walls and walls and walls and the mother will not come. It will be very difficult.

JB

I liken it to all the information that you see, read, hear it becomes like pollution in your brain and your body and it festers and it grows and grows and grows. Ayahuasca flushes it out and it’s like a river that has become really  polluted and stagnant and then a big tidal wave comes through, mother ayahuasca, and clears all the pollution out and then it is free flowing, blue, beautiful and there is loads of life.

DG

The worst thing of that is that besides pollution it creates expectations of what you have read. Maybe you have read that somebody got into a very dark – “ oh my god, the darkness comes! The demons!” and you are waiting for this and others say “oh it is beautiful, the colours and the visions and the  patterns!” and you are expecting this. Sometimes there is no colours and patterns but you have beautiful insights. Sometimes there is not even insights but you go to the toilet 5 times and you purge, a beautiful cleansing. So the way to come is just to surrender with trust, no mind, no control, no expectations. This is how you should go. I know it sounds easy – it is easy. I always give the example: If your mother comes to you when you are 5 and grabs your hand and says “come with me” and you don’t even know where she is taking you but she is your mother and you trust her and you go with her blindly. Same here. Mother ayahuasca is a reresentation of motherhood. All the mothers in one. Many people have got closure with bad moments of their mothers which they couldn’t before they passed. And they have closure with mother ayahuasca. It is motherhood itself. Others they raise the mother who has passed and they can speak to their mother. One of the best ways to connect with your loved ones that have already passed is this door. It is a big door. They usually come and talk to you.

JB

When it comes to purging and ensuring that you don’t make the same mistakes that caused the original poison within you , what other practices could help outside of this ceremony in everyday life to maintain the pureness that ayahuasca instilled into you.

DG

The message is very clear. Ayahuasca cleanses you through all the body holes. Through going to the toilet – the rear, and your mouth, your eyes through crying, even your ears and even your sexual area. So all the doors, the holes of your body that are used to cleanse are the ones that you unconsciously use to get contaminated. Mouth – whatever comes from your words. You can heal or you can really damage somebody with your words. Food coming in, it can be very healthy or very contaminated. Your eyes, you can see somebody with love in your eyes or hate in the eyes or whatever you watch – television – killing, accidents, war, blood comes through here and feeds inside again and again and again. Sounds – you can listen to beautiful classical music or whatever you like, soft music, new age which nurtures you or you can go in a bloody discotheque – really really loud and it goes through here (ears) contaminating. And also the words you hear. If you go out with a gang and they use 9 swear words out of 10 then you get contaminated. If that happens tell them “ no, excuse me I’m leaving” because those words are loaded with the meaning that they put on them – hate, envy. Even the sexual area is the biggest gate. A condom can stop the disease but the condom can’t stop the energy and all the couples that are still there for 7 years in the energy and they will go through you without knowing and vice versa. So you have to be very careful with it. That is the answer. If you cleanse through the holes, keep your holes closed. Or open for the right things to come.

JB

Thank you so much for the wonderful 3 nights and all the good work for cleansing so many people and helping people to reach and live from their heart again and find love and to be good and righteous.

DG

Thank you, I am very happy to share this and whenever you want I am at your service. Thank you for listening.


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